Thanks for sharing. This was something I was considering to get a little more power.
JB4/BMS Tune Problematic
Hey I just uninstalled my JB4/BMS tune on my SEL 4Motion after a slew of performance issues that I wanted to just share my experience in case anyone wants one. Now I could have absolutely gotten a defective one or something but it was just one thing after another.
First things first it was a BEESH to install. Took an hour and a half and that TMAP sensor is way back there and you can BARELY stick your hand back there so you need some long long screwdrivers and such. They will be your friend in trying to get that sensor off.
Once the tune is on and all the plugs are on it’s straightforward. Plug it in the OBD2 and fire up the app and start your car up. I was using Map 2 as instructed running 91 octane (since Utah is weird, that’s the highest). Drove my first couple times with it and enjoyed the power and extra kick.
The dummy lights like instructed came on and then turned off but that’s where it went south. From the 3rd drive forward it flagged the EPC EVERY TIME you drive it within the first couple miles. The EPC (electronic power control) turns your car to limp mode, reducing all turbo and boost. Now merging onto the freeway in this is going 0-60mph in about 25 seconds which is dangerous beyond belief.
I reached out to BMS just to get some support and they wanted to know what codes were posting which were P0106 and P0238 respectively. I didn’t get an answer what those codes even indicate but to try and troubleshoot some more and see what’s causing it. I unfortunately decided to uninstall it and go back to stock since it was just dangerous for my highway driving and going into limp mode every time I drive. All my lights went off, and a check engine light that appeared while the tune was installed is now gone as well.
I very well could have gotten a bad one as I’ve heard reports of bad harnesses, some bad connectors and so forth, but I just wanted to share some of my personal experience with the tune and I wasn’t overly happy with the experience considering I’ve asked for help and never got much from them to dig into the issue before I felt like I’ve given enough time (4 days of emailing to start diagnosing).
Thanks
Max
First things first it was a BEESH to install. Took an hour and a half and that TMAP sensor is way back there and you can BARELY stick your hand back there so you need some long long screwdrivers and such. They will be your friend in trying to get that sensor off.
Once the tune is on and all the plugs are on it’s straightforward. Plug it in the OBD2 and fire up the app and start your car up. I was using Map 2 as instructed running 91 octane (since Utah is weird, that’s the highest). Drove my first couple times with it and enjoyed the power and extra kick.
The dummy lights like instructed came on and then turned off but that’s where it went south. From the 3rd drive forward it flagged the EPC EVERY TIME you drive it within the first couple miles. The EPC (electronic power control) turns your car to limp mode, reducing all turbo and boost. Now merging onto the freeway in this is going 0-60mph in about 25 seconds which is dangerous beyond belief.
I reached out to BMS just to get some support and they wanted to know what codes were posting which were P0106 and P0238 respectively. I didn’t get an answer what those codes even indicate but to try and troubleshoot some more and see what’s causing it. I unfortunately decided to uninstall it and go back to stock since it was just dangerous for my highway driving and going into limp mode every time I drive. All my lights went off, and a check engine light that appeared while the tune was installed is now gone as well.
I very well could have gotten a bad one as I’ve heard reports of bad harnesses, some bad connectors and so forth, but I just wanted to share some of my personal experience with the tune and I wasn’t overly happy with the experience considering I’ve asked for help and never got much from them to dig into the issue before I felt like I’ve given enough time (4 days of emailing to start diagnosing).
Thanks
Max
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
those two codes are MAP and boost sensor issues which probably means 'outside expected range' for throttle position/rpm.
I don't understand why you'd need more power, its perfectly fine the way it is. I grab my LS1 if need to be pushed into my seat.
reality though. taking an aftermarket tuner on a brand new engine model is probably premature during its first year. those companies haven't had time to work out the tunes and you have no idea the reduction of life on the engine or turbo.
I don't understand why you'd need more power, its perfectly fine the way it is. I grab my LS1 if need to be pushed into my seat.
reality though. taking an aftermarket tuner on a brand new engine model is probably premature during its first year. those companies haven't had time to work out the tunes and you have no idea the reduction of life on the engine or turbo.
Yeah, even if you get a 10% bump in power it still won't be fast.those two codes are MAP and boost sensor issues which probably means 'outside expected range' for throttle position/rpm.
I don't understand why you'd need more power, its perfectly fine the way it is. I grab my LS1 if need to be pushed into my seat.
reality though. taking an aftermarket tuner on a brand new engine model is probably premature during its first year. those companies haven't had time to work out the tunes and you have no idea the reduction of life on the engine or turbo.
And I agree - I'd be really nervous adding a tuning box to a new car in the first year while still under warranty.
I also don't like the way it seems to work (if I understand it correctly). It looks like it just spoofs a few sensor inputs with no change to the ECU programming which seems like a pretty low tech solution. Aftermarket tuning nowadays typically requires in-depth knowledge of the ECU programming to really be able to make fairly safe, beneficial changes. Though they will usually come at some expense in terms of reliability, longevity, or economy - there's a reason the manufacturer programmed it the way they did.
it is far harder and more dangerous to the system to add power to gas engines than diesels. 10% would be a large gain. spoofing timings isn't a bad way to do it, a reflash is a more traditional model. I've had a spoof based system on my truck for years. The key is what changes are made. in both methods. I don't think a few months is enough time for proper testing of this type of change if you are not the MFG and you don't know the designs and strength of every component in the system, all the way to the tires.
to each his own.
to each his own.
I had been considering getting the Jb4 as well, has anyone else experienced this, or have you gotten an answer from BMS?
Never got any answers for the codes it through from BMS and I returned it for a refund.I had been considering getting the Jb4 as well, has anyone else experienced this, or have you gotten an answer from BMS?
I’ve been made to install these on a number of vehicles. From Audi through BMW and Porsche. Not one ever worked as stated.
They are horrible to fit. I personally think they are way too generic and trying to find a good place for the huge box is stupid. Their tech support is less than great. I remember once being told to go out and data log the car. A relatively new 911. this was a customers car and being told to go out and beat the living crap out of it so they can get logs was ridiculous. Customer support sucked too
it never really worked and we uninstalled it for a real flash tune.
They are horrible to fit. I personally think they are way too generic and trying to find a good place for the huge box is stupid. Their tech support is less than great. I remember once being told to go out and data log the car. A relatively new 911. this was a customers car and being told to go out and beat the living crap out of it so they can get logs was ridiculous. Customer support sucked too
it never really worked and we uninstalled it for a real flash tune.
So I had the same concern re:turbo longevity. I actually emailed George from BMS a week or so ago (before I saw this) and he told me they hadn't released a JB4 for the 1.5TSI until recently even though it's been out in Europe for 5-6 years now because of the kangarooing issues, and he said they asked Euro tuners of these engines what sort of failures they saw so they could set the JB4 tune more conservative than those. After reading this I'll probably hold off for a while longer.those two codes are MAP and boost sensor issues which probably means 'outside expected range' for throttle position/rpm.
I don't understand why you'd need more power, its perfectly fine the way it is. I grab my LS1 if need to be pushed into my seat.
reality though. taking an aftermarket tuner on a brand new engine model is probably premature during its first year. those companies haven't had time to work out the tunes and you have no idea the reduction of life on the engine or turbo.
I'd prefer a real flash tune as well but I value my warranty and don't want to get TD1'd, so waiting it is.I’ve been made to install these on a number of vehicles. From Audi through BMW and Porsche. Not one ever worked as stated.
They are horrible to fit. I personally think they are way too generic and trying to find a good place for the huge box is stupid. Their tech support is less than great. I remember once being told to go out and data log the car. A relatively new 911. this was a customers car and being told to go out and beat the living crap out of it so they can get logs was ridiculous. Customer support sucked too
it never really worked and we uninstalled it for a real flash tune.
How significant was the power increase after installing the JB4? I'm considering it until APR comes out with a tune. Please let me know.Hey I just uninstalled my JB4/BMS tune on my SEL 4Motion after a slew of performance issues that I wanted to just share my experience in case anyone wants one. Now I could have absolutely gotten a defective one or something but it was just one thing after another.
First things first it was a BEESH to install. Took an hour and a half and that TMAP sensor is way back there and you can BARELY stick your hand back there so you need some long long screwdrivers and such. They will be your friend in trying to get that sensor off.
Once the tune is on and all the plugs are on it’s straightforward. Plug it in the OBD2 and fire up the app and start your car up. I was using Map 2 as instructed running 91 octane (since Utah is weird, that’s the highest). Drove my first couple times with it and enjoyed the power and extra kick.
The dummy lights like instructed came on and then turned off but that’s where it went south. From the 3rd drive forward it flagged the EPC EVERY TIME you drive it within the first couple miles. The EPC (electronic power control) turns your car to limp mode, reducing all turbo and boost. Now merging onto the freeway in this is going 0-60mph in about 25 seconds which is dangerous beyond belief.
I reached out to BMS just to get some support and they wanted to know what codes were posting which were P0106 and P0238 respectively. I didn’t get an answer what those codes even indicate but to try and troubleshoot some more and see what’s causing it. I unfortunately decided to uninstall it and go back to stock since it was just dangerous for my highway driving and going into limp mode every time I drive. All my lights went off, and a check engine light that appeared while the tune was installed is now gone as well.
I very well could have gotten a bad one as I’ve heard reports of bad harnesses, some bad connectors and so forth, but I just wanted to share some of my personal experience with the tune and I wasn’t overly happy with the experience considering I’ve asked for help and never got much from them to dig into the issue before I felt like I’ve given enough time (4 days of emailing to start diagnosing).
Thanks
Max
Considering buying a Taos.... for all the people here who say they will jump jump into name that mullet mobile or fast car COOL. Some of us wish we had those options. Others of us either starting familes and leaving the scene of our fun cars or just need a compact AWD vehicle in a certain price range... your comments really dont help or apply. Anyways, Iam a little shocked no major VAG tuner seems to have broken encryption on these Taos ECUS yet. Friends, whatever this JB4 nonsense is.... if it requires your to splice into the map and some sort of other sensor PASS IT UP. Ive worked on alot of difference brands and these piggy backs are never EVER as good as a flash tune via OBD. They just arent. They have a learning curve, they chomp into your factory wiring harness, and almost always make WAYYYYYYYYY LESSSS HP and Torque then a proper flash tune, as they only override / gain control of 2 functions/ parameters of the car. I found it a little crazy APR at the very least, if not IE doesnt already have a product out for this engine, but I promise you they miss no one. Give the platform and this 1.5T a little more time, they are probably working on it now and even have tunes out on beta cars as we speak. As for 10% improvements.... in VAG product turbo vehicles thats almost never the case. my Mk4 jetta went from 155hp and 180 tq to 240hp and 280tq. My Mk5 GTI went from 200hp / 207tq to 271hp and 295 tq with a downpipe and tune. Hell my 2001 b5 audi s4 went from 255hp and 260 tq to 318hp and 390 tq.... VW historically always undertunes their engines. They underpower the shit out of them compared to what they could be, and thats the same reason why other modern turbo brands always have higher off the shelf HP until you tune your VW. The other guys went with higher stock tunes for the numbers, but when you go to tune those, while you still get great uplifts, its nothing like a vw audi group product. SOOOOOO much to be had by a tune. The Taos will get a proper tune... APR usually gets euro specs cards ahead of launch here and starts working , and then concludes there research and testing once the US model releases.... that might have thrown things off. If we think along the same lines of what the tunes for the jetta 1.4T was, i would expect the Taos 158hp ./ 184 tq, to explode even with a stage 1 tune and no full exhaust / intake. look forward to a IE or APR tune coming in for 500-600 bucks USD and bring it up to 200hp, and probably 250 - 280 ft lbs. It wont be a rocket machine but it will be solid and that little SUV will feel like the way it should have come from the factory. I remember chip tuning my wifews 2014 tiguan with 2.0T a year after we bought it and it was amazing. Fully unloaded we clocked 1 run at 13.9 with it, and the rest in the low 14s. Heavier vehicle than the golf but better grip than the GTI's with the AWD. I would constantly smoke things I shouldnt have on the highway, and with a hybrid BOV, if you used to be into tuner german cars it makes you feel right at home. you get the turbo WHOOOSH sound, and you get enough power to feel like you can pass those who dont want to be passed at the last second. Of course i surmise the taos wone have quite the ass of the chipped tiguan which was like 268hp and 336 ft lbs of torque on the stage 1+ which required an intake. Either way it wasnt FAST like a purpose built sports car or hot hatch, but it was DAMN thrilling or a compact SUV, and it gave alot of unsuspecting compeitors a bad day. For those buying the Taos who are in a wsimilar position to me i imagine your goals are the same, Maybe you used to have a tuned GTI or something else that again was quick but not FAST, and you just want to be able to have a little fun sometimes. If we got MAX to MAX curb weights the taos could weigh as much as 200 lbs less than tiguan, or if we go with the lowest curb weights yout taos could weigh upto 150 lbs less the the lightest tiguan. ( tiguans weighed 3397 lb ti 3591 lbs, vs taos at 3175 to 3430. Once the main tuners release their 1.5 taos tunes.... and trust me they will, snag those. That will ge the good shit DONT resport to splicing wires into your factory harness for laughable gains. NOT WORTH IT, and the ECU flash will make alot more things possible , and also safer while delivering muchg needed power jumps.
I am waiting for someone to make a tune also.
Decided to E-Mail George at Burger Tuning about the JB4 and this is what he replied........
Hi,
WE have had some issues. At this point we not sure if its variance related from car to car or if there is a production issue with the JB4.
We are getting a car in for three weeks of testing and will be going through the returned units on that car just to figure it out.
I can email you an update once we are done and are confident there will be no issues.
Best,
George
www.burgertuning.com
Hi,
WE have had some issues. At this point we not sure if its variance related from car to car or if there is a production issue with the JB4.
We are getting a car in for three weeks of testing and will be going through the returned units on that car just to figure it out.
I can email you an update once we are done and are confident there will be no issues.
Best,
George
www.burgertuning.com
I wouldn’t touch these products with a a very long stick
Same. I remember them starting their early development of the Juicebox (JB) line on BMW forums many, many years ago and yikes, what a mess that was. Turned me off of the company for good. Fooling critical engine sensors isn't the way to go and piggybacks tend to be a one-size-fits-all approach. You're just asking for headaches.
If you must have more power from our little 1.5, wait for a proper tune from APR or equivalent. I've used APR tunes on past cars, even GIAC, and never had an issue.
And yes, dealers can tell if the car had a piggyback installed. I've read accounts from a few forum members that tried getting turbos replaced but were denied. The ECU logged when things are operating out of spec.
If you must have more power from our little 1.5, wait for a proper tune from APR or equivalent. I've used APR tunes on past cars, even GIAC, and never had an issue.
And yes, dealers can tell if the car had a piggyback installed. I've read accounts from a few forum members that tried getting turbos replaced but were denied. The ECU logged when things are operating out of spec.
Yea this engine isn’t one to be messed with. No need it’s good enough as it is.
want a GTi buy a GTi 😜
want a GTi buy a GTi 😜
Just an update.....
I have been emailing burgertuning and they have fixed the issues with the JB4. Here is the chain of emails...
Hi,
WE have had some issues. At this point we not sure if its variance related from car to car or if there is a production issue with the JB4.
We are getting a car in for three weeks of testing and will be going through the returned units on that car just to figure it out.
I can email you an update once we are done and are confident there will be no issues.
Best,
George
Then.......
Hi,
We managed to recreate the issue that some users where having and have solved the problem now so you good to go. We strapped the car down to get some numbers on the dyno too.
I have been emailing burgertuning and they have fixed the issues with the JB4. Here is the chain of emails...
Hi,
WE have had some issues. At this point we not sure if its variance related from car to car or if there is a production issue with the JB4.
We are getting a car in for three weeks of testing and will be going through the returned units on that car just to figure it out.
I can email you an update once we are done and are confident there will be no issues.
Best,
George
Then.......
Hi,
We managed to recreate the issue that some users where having and have solved the problem now so you good to go. We strapped the car down to get some numbers on the dyno too.
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
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